A circa 1905 view of Whalley New Road, looking towards Bastwell, with St Michael's & All Angels Church and adjoining school on the left hand side and the wall to Notre Dame convent on the right.
At the bottom, a section of the OS map for Paul (Please see comments below). Apologies for the blurred image, but hopefully it is clear enough to see what you need. I have marked the property that was the vicarage with a red dot Paul. Just to the left of it, in the grounds, you can see the abbreviation 'Vic'. Cutting up through the centre of the map is Whalley New Rd.
I also found these four images below on Cottontown Paul. They're obviously later than my postcard image, as there are cars in them. The bottom two are of the property that I thought was the Vicarage (No 41 W.N.Rd), but was were the verger was living in my old directories. Cottontown has both labelled as 'The Vicarage', so maybe it was in later times.
P/C COURTESY OF THE CP COLLECTION
OTHER PHOTOS COURTESY OF COTTONTOWN / BLACKBURN LIBRARY SERVICES
MAP SECTION COURTESY OF THE O.S.
I love this one, it brings back so many memories. The trams were before my days but the double decker bus used to drop us off just outside the sweetshop on the left after the church. Thanks Colin!ReplyDelete
Thanks for posting the photo of St Michaels,it is nice to finally see the church where one of my ancestors was the Vicar for 20 odd years.ReplyDelete
What a waste of a fine building,did it even make it to it's 100 year which would have been 1969 before they pulled it down.
You wouldn't happen to know where the Vicarage was situated would you?.One possible site could be what is now the St Michael's Church centre on Palm street corner,if it is old enough.
Keep up the good work
I'm not exactly sure when the church disappeared.
I've always thought the stone built house (still standing and still occupied) right next to the church was the vicarage. If you click on the photo and enlarge it a little, you can just see the building I mean, it's kind of aligned with the front end of the tram. It fronts onto Whalley New Rd and backs onto the brook (River Blakewater).
But having just checked in my 1894 trade directory, the vicarage was on the corner of Maple St. Basically, if you have passed through the Bastwell traffic lights, what was the Bastwell pub is on your left, then Maple St is the first street on your right and the vicarage is the large house on the upper corner.
Thanks for the speedy reply. I will check back through my census records to see if there is any mention of Maple street corner.
Have you noticed that the building you thought was the vicarage is still there (or it is on Streetview) recognisable by the 6 large windows facing the road. It is Elite Blinds according to the signs,and the new build part is their wharehouse and a car spares place which is where the church used to stand.
If you compare your photo with the same Streetview you can still see the wall with railings on it from in front of the church and the basic plot which backs upto the brook.
According to the 1910 map on your site or the Cotonworld site the building before the church was the school.
I'm useless on Google Streetview, I can't navigate, plus my PC always seems to crash when I try and use Streetview.
Yes the building I thought was the vicarage is still there, I passed by about a month ago. Like I say, it's occupied / lived in.
That building that was the school, was part of East Lancs Coach Builders when I joined them in 1974. We used to play football at lunchtimes in what had been the playground at the rear.
I think Elite Blinds are actually in what was the old school, rather than a part of the car tyre place (Shaffi's or something, they're called).
In my 1894 directory, the occupant of the vicarage was the Rev W. Thomason. In my 1925 directory it was the Rev E. Hanson B.A. and in my 1951 directory it was the Rev G. Jackson.
I hope that's of some help.
They're the only three detailed directories I have and they only name the person living there, nothing else.
Thanks for the map and the look-ups.
It looks as if my relative missed out on the nice big vicarage at 2 Maple Street he was Vicar for the 1861/71/81 Census and his address was 48 Whalley new road which was 5 houses before the Convent,pretty near where the St Michaels Church center is ,they probaly knocked the vicarage down to make Palm street,which dosen't seem to be on the 1891 Census.
I found the big house on Maple street in the 1891 census and you might have heard of the owner ?.....a Mr Henry Shuttleworth,"Cotton manufacturer,employing 300 persons and children"
I've just re-read one of your comments Paul. It's not the two storey building with the 6 large windows on this side of the church that I thought was the vicarage (that was the school). There's another building, a large detached house, at the far side of the church, with a pitched roof. That's the one that I thought was once the vicarage.ReplyDelete
The two storey building (Elite Blinds) was, as I mention above, part of ELCB. They had their blacksmith on the ground floor and welding shops on the upper floor when I worked there (1974 - 78).
just been reading up on the history of the oldDelete
vicarage house that i am now renting, its got so much to tell and i am very happy to be living here and thank you to everyone that told there bit about it.mr boyle
Thank you Mr Boyle and glad you found it interesting.ReplyDelete
The property that I was thinking of Paul, just beyond the church is No 41 Whalley New Rd and in both my 1925 directory and my 1951 directory, it is occupied by the verger of St Michael's.
In the 1894 directory, the same property was occupied by a draper ?
Right after all our hard work I think the following is the list of Vicarages of
St Michael and all Angels as known now.
1861=,Somewhere on the Whalley New road, no 48?
1871=,48 Whalley New road
1881=,48 Whalley New road
1894=,2 Maple Street/Corner of Whalley New road
1925=,41 Whalley New road
1951=,41 Whalley New road
Church pulled down 1960-70's?
Good work there thanks for that.
Mr Boyle,which one are you renting?
It was the verger at No 41 Whalley New Rd, not the Vicar. The verger would be the person that looked after the church I think. Cleaned it, opened it up and locked it etc.
The Vicarage is listed in my directories as No 1 Maple Street (they must be the odd numbers on that side). The three guys I mention above, the Rev's Thomason (1894), Hanson (1925) and Jackson (1951) are all at that address.
At No 41 Whalley New Rd, there was a draper living there in 1894, but then in both the 1925 directory and the 1951 directory, the occupant was the verger.
Apologies for any confusion.
thank you for writing back so soon.it is number 41 whalley new rd were i am living, and i love all the history with it and if you could i would like to know abit more about the river blakewater at the back of meDelete
mr p boyle
Type this into your browser, loads of info.ReplyDelete
I've just added four more photos to this post Paul. There's also some internal shots of the church on Cottontown if you're interested. Possibly all taken just before it closed, maybe someone making a record of the place knowing it was soon to be demolished. There's not much info with them, but they look to be late 1960's / early 1970's (All in black & white anyway).ReplyDelete
Excellent work there.I looked on Cottontown, what search terms are you using as I did'nt come up with much at all?
After much Googling I did come up with the following from the Blackburn Diocese records of Church disposals
St Michael and all Angels
25/6/1984-Projected sale for use as office or shopping
So a little later than we thought,still a great waste of a nice looking church,
St Michaels and all the Angels photograph.
The car in the foreground looks to be a 4 Door Austin Marina which did not start production until 1971 and finished in 1980 so mid 70's to 80's looks about right.
Do you have acess to the maps you originally posted O/s 1910 and 1880?? if it was extend more it would show all the possible choices for the vicarage, would it be marked ?
I've replaced the map section with another, which is a little more clear.
Click on it to enlarge it a little.
If you look towards the bottom centre, the school is marked. I have marked the church beside it with a green line / mark. The verger's house (No 41 W.N.Rd), which I thought was the vicarage (could have been at some point), I have marked with a couple of red dots. Opposite that almost, on the corner of Palm St, I have marked the converted properties that now serve as St Michael's church (or centre) in blue and then towards the top right, I have marked with red, the large property on the corner of Maple St, that was the vicarage.
On the 1929 OS map, that property on Maple St is clearly marked 'Vic' for vicarage, but it isn't marked on the map I've just uploaded (the 1910 OS map). The 1929 map is basically the the 1910 map just updated a bit. They didn't do another survey in 1929, they just amended the 1910 map (as far as I'm aware).
The house on Maple St (No 1) was definitely the vicarage in 1894, 1925 and 1951, as it is recorded as such in the directories, along with the names of the vicars at those times (see the above comments).
The property by the church (No 41 Whalley New Rd) was definitely were the verger lived, as it too is recorded in the 1925 and 1951 directories.
The reference library in town, has the complete set of trade directories from about 1870 - 1966. They were only issued about once every 4 years, but if you were to consult them all, you could probably determine where the vicar of St Michael's resided through the decades.
I can't remember what I typed into the Cottontown 'search' Paul. I think I just typed St Michael's.ReplyDelete
Excellent work,thanks a lot.
I searched in the 1891 census for the William Thomason you had in the 1894 directories as the vicar,and he was vicar then ,the house was between numbers 116 and 118 Whalley new road ,but I am thinking it was the one on Maple street corner and the numbering was just wrong.
On the 1861 census there only seems to be about 10 houses between the Thwaites Arms pub and the Convent on that side so as they gradually infilled the blanks they must have re numbered the street several
That's how it appears in my directories too. It has 116 W.N.Rd, then in italics it has Vicarage and then the next property on W.N.Rd.
The vicarage fronts onto Maple St. I passed there yesterday coming back from Clitheroe and was stopped in traffic at the lights, so craned my neck back to have a look. It has two large bay windows, both facing maple St, with the door between them. It looks like one of those villas you see in other parts of town. More than likely, it will have been there since mid Victorian times (if not before), probably before many of the surrounding streets were built.
As you said in one of your earlier comments, a Henry Shuttleworth lived there. He probably had it built. Maybe he was in partnership with the Hornby's who had their mills around that way (see the Notre Dame post), or maybe he had his own mill(s).
The Shuttleworth family were the folks that had Gawthorpe Hall I think and were more out Padiham / Burnley / Simonstone / Read way.
I'll get a photo of the property on Maple St sometime, if I can and add it to this post.
I don't think there's many properties along that route on the 1840's OS map. I think the area only started to populate from around that time (1800 onwards) and sort of peaked in the decades after 1840/50.
The main route to Whalley / Clitheroe and beyond had been via the old road (along Cob Wall and up through Little Harwood, then over the tops)
Something else I found out on Cottontown. The war memorial from St Michael's is now in the cathedral grounds, it's just over the wall / railings behind Queen Victoria's statue. They must have re-sited it there when the church was demolished in the 80's.
Managed to find all the photos you mentioned on Cottontown ,eventually!,thanks for that.
Henry Shuttleworth who was living at the house on Whalley New Road/Maple Street 1891 is listed on the census as "Cotton manufacturer employing 300 persons and children"
According to Cottontown he went Bankcrupt twice and he was not at that address in 1901,so was probably on the way down again.
Before my relative became the first vicar of St Michaels and all the Angels in 1869ish he was the last Vicar at St Michaels which was originally a Weslyian church that the Church of England bought in 1839 and opened in 1844.
This was on the corner of Belper street/Derby street and was used until the new one was ready,it looks to have then been used by the United Methodists at least until 1955 according to the O/S map,must have been bulldozed with the whole area(appart from the swimming baths)
in the 60's.
He was living at 10 Primrose bank in 1851,there are a few photos on Cottontown,have you got anything in your collection of St Michaels church?
No I haven't any more photos of the church on Whalley New Rd, nor the other chapel you mention, on Belper St/Derby St.
If I do come across anything, I'll add them to this post.